Re: [APD] Contents of Aquatic-Plants Digest, Vol 54, Issue 23

[Baron <baronofwatford at bellsouth_net>]

I must say, you do have strong opinions about thing. Let's take a look 
at what it is you believe and what the facts actually are.

First you say:"I hate to be blunt with you, but the question wasn't 
about whether fluoride is safe for humans The consensus is already 
clear, that no - it is not."

To this I respond, you are wrong.That would be like saying air is bad 
for your fish. While it is true our fish can't live in a box with no 
water, it is also true fish can't live in water without air. It is about 
the levels we need to look at here and not the scary words.

Second you say, "Naturally occurring calcium fluoride is fine, at safe 
levels, and some countries with too much calcium fluoride in their 
underground water veins take steps to filter it out"

To this I respond, you are almost right. The countries you are referring 
to are actually filtering out that which dissolved the calcium fluoride 
into the water to start with and as a by product of that filtering 
process, the calcium fluoride is also removed. It is also funny, even in 
the banned countries, if we give them the fluoride and they don't have 
to pay for it, then they decide to add it.

Third you say, "Fluoride Hexasilicate, the stuff Alcoa used to throw 
away before they realized they could make money by poisoning people, is 
undebateably toxic, and contains lots of lead and arsenic." (The word 
you were looking for here was undebatable as undebateably is not a real 
word)

To this I respond, you are almost right again. While I will agree 
fluoride hexasilicate is toxic, so is water in high enough doses. So are 
most medicines given to extend our lives or to make us well. Once again, 
it is about levels. I really would have thought someone who keeps an 
aquarium would understands balancing levels better than the average person.

Fourth you say, "By the way, the American Pediatric Association as 
warned against using fluoridated tap water to prepare baby formula with 
since the blood-brain barrier is not fully developed in the infant."

To this I respond, A very good attempt at giving only part of the truth. 
The whole truth to that memo says the American Pediatric Association 
issued a warning against using fluoridated tap water to prepare baby 
formula with since the blood-brain barrier is not fully developed in the 
infant.They also stressed the importance of drinking fluoridated water.  
If you live in a non fluoridated area, your child's doctor or dentist 
may prescribe fluoride drops, tablets, or vitamins after your baby is 6 
months old. The American Academy of Pediatrics recommends that these 
fluoride supplements be given daily to children between the ages of 6 
months and 16 years. I guess that part of the memo didn't help you so 
you just left it out.

Fifth you said, "Anyways, this is not the venue for debate, I was just 
wondering what you people in the aquaria world though about it, and 
needless to say, the bunch of you are misinformed.

To this I respond, as you trend would seem to indicate, you are wrong. 
The internet is a wonderful venue for debate. And as for being 
misinformed, you do not know the people on this list. Most will not 
recognize my name because I usually have nothing to add beyond what 
others know and share so easily. Some advocacy groups publish reports on 
the hazards of fluoridation, and they point to toxicity warnings on 
toothpaste, concluding that any substance needing such careful dosage 
must be dangerous. Remember, it's about the levels. In response to 
claims that water fluoridation is dangerous, the National Institutes of 
Health (NIH) reviewed research on dental cavities prevention and public 
policy, including fluoridation. It agreed with anti fluoride activists 
that many studies in this area are of poor quality. However, the NIH 
panel also concluded that the unevenness of research does not invalidate 
the clear benefits of fluoride. The NIH believes that the dramatic 
reductions in tooth decay in the past 30 years are due to fluoridation 
of the water supply, and parents and health professionals should 
continue to ensure that kids receive enough fluoride to prevent 
cavities. I can hear you thinking now, "If some fluoride is good, why 
not give children as much fluoride as possible?" I guess to that I would 
say, let's look at your planted aquarium for a moment. If a little iron 
is good for your plants, then more is better right? As with most 
minerals and vitamins, overexposure can be harmful. Most children get 
the right amount of fluoride through a combination of fluoridated 
toothpaste and fluoridated water or supplements. Too much fluoride 
before 8 years of age can cause enamel fluorosis, a discoloration or 
mottling of the permanent teeth. This condition is unsightly but 
harmless and often can be treated with cosmetic procedures. Most cases 
of fluorosis occur in children who take unnecessary daily fluoride 
supplements even though they brush regularly with fluoridated toothpaste 
and their home's tap water contains good levels of fluoride. Misuse of 
fluoride products, including rinses and toothpaste, also can contribute 
to fluorosis, but this is less common. Very rarely, fluoride toxicity 
can occur when large amounts of fluoride are ingested during a short 
period of time. Children under age 6 account for more than 80% of 
reports of suspected over ingestion. Although outcomes are generally not 
serious, fluoride toxicity sends several hundred children to emergency 
rooms each year.Symptoms of fluoride toxicity may include nausea, 
diarrhea, vomiting, abdominal pain, increased salivation, or increased 
thirst. Symptoms begin 30 minutes after ingestion and can last up to 24 
hours. Annual deaths due to fluoride overdoses are less than 1 per year. 
I can give sources, dates and studies to show everything I have said is 
solely based on the facts and are true. My profession, that would be 
retired. My credential's: Director of a Genetics lab at the National 
Institutes of Health and retired professor from Duke University. I am 
always learning more about plants and how to keep them alive here. So, 
please feel free to respond to anything I have said, I will be happy to 
answer. Understand, it will only be based on facts, not emotions.

I hope this helps, but probably not,

Dr. James Watford
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