[APD] RE: algae killers

[Thomas Barr <tcbiii at yahoo_com>]

"with
me
for almost 10 months now - during which time I pruned out plants by the
bucketful.
Consistant conditions? Didn't work for the black film at all. I then took to
varying
different conditions trying to see what it won't like. It likes most
conditions I give it.
Then I got BBA. You can't prune driftwood and with the slate bottom I had
attached to it, I didn't want to pull it out. Scrubbing it? Tried that - and
it came back.
I pruned all the Anubias but it came back on the new leaves. It's nearly
impossible
to get rid of it off the flourite. I spent countless hours with a tweezer
trying to get it
all out - nearly impossible. My CO2 levels are consistent - always above
25ppm.
BBA may have bloomed when I ran out of CO2 and it took 2-3days for me to
get a refill but levels have been consistant besides that."

FWIW, simply rotating the top 1 inch under the substrate will take only a few minutes and clean the gravel up nicely. I'm not sure what you do when you have an algae problem, but I get it all out and then double check everything and do water changes and nutrient resets etc till it's good. Then I keep up on it. 

But there's a basic tennet:

Why don't your other tanks have this also if the environmental conditions are not similar?

If you make no change in your environmental routine, the algae will simply come back. unless you plan on aspetic techinque.......

So why don't your other tanks have it if it's not the environment? Those spores can make it there and likely are there.

But the algae is not growing.........and no "algae fix" either.

So why might that be?

BBA and the other algae certainly lend a strong impication to the environment.I never get BBA under those conditions. Never. These algae are good bioindicators of your tank's health/state. 

"Because of the algae, which has plauged that setup since the beginning, that
tank has gotten
a LOT more attention then the algae free tank - so I don't think neglect
caused it. I think I got
that black film off a trade early on - and it didn't want to go away.
However...well..let's just say that it aint a problem now. ;)"

So what will prevent it from reappearing if you have it good conditions to start with? More algicide? And it will come back....

So why has it not appeared in your other tank/s? Those spores are very difficult to prevent transfer.If you are giving the tanks the same treatment environmentally, you should have it in most of your tanks. But you don't.    

> So your plants are now growing better? That's the only way you will have
the upper hand.
> It's not about algae, it's about plants.

"Plants have been growing good all this time. The only time the plants
weren't growing too well
is when I had way too much K in there. Cutting that back improved plant
growth dramatically.
I know you think there isn't such a thing as too much K. Too much of
anything, or too little
for that matter, causes issues. Especially in a 'closed' environment such as
an aquarium."


Well I used it quite liberally in hard, soft and medium tap waters and had no problems, so did a few hundred others, for many years, so.....yes, I have seen high K+ tanks with many plant species. You say it exist well, tell about a plant or reason why my plants did well and yours did not. Talk about a plant that will not dop well in a higher K+ tank please.

If someone else is doing it, then your premise based solely on K+ being too high, does not seem valid.

The same thing existed with PO4, people said it caused algae. I add it and it doesn't cause algae. So does it cause algae? Same deal with K+, NO3, NH4 etc. Correlation is not causation.

You say it's excess but I clearly grew plants at very high healthy levels at 50ppm of K+.

I know I do not need that much for healthy growth, but it never did anything to the plants negatively. I also don't need 2ppm of PO4, but it also does not do anything negative either. If the plant's needs are being met, there's no need to have 20+ppm, 10 is fine. Or just enough so it does not run out for more than a few hours/day.

I have worked with many of these nutrients one at a time, unless you do that process you have not isolated the cause/effect. Most folks don't do that. They just want a nice tank without algae. 

I've used some 7-10 remendies over the years, most people do at some point. But I know better now.  Some folks go that path. I learned not use them. I also see clearly I simpy never needed them either to begin with.  

"KH 4, GH 6. CO2 at about 25-30 ppm. 50% water changes weekly - religously. I
add back the traces
right after the water change and the macros a day later. Dose every other
day."

Sounds good.

PO4? NO3?, fish load? The CO2 gets everyone, myself included. BBA is classic poor CO2 issue, check the probe, the KH measurement etc and then add more CO2 than you trhink you need/measure and see what happens. 

Even the best person here needs to check CO2 often if things are not going well in a tank. That's the first thing. Then check it again. Check the kits etc.  

"But after 10 months of trying everything - with plants growing plants like
crazy - I was sick and tired
of this algae. Now its gone and I can enjoy my tank. Did I take a shortcut?
Maybe - but I gave it 10 months."

Hell I'll be right over, I'm going to clean your tank out:)

Really, I would if I was close enough to. I've knock out algae out of countless tanks. 


> I need a nasty algae ridden tank and do a focus group on this next time.
It's not brain surgery.
> FWIW you can add light amounts of CuSO4, H2O2 etc to kill algae too. But
these don't grow plants either.

"Copper is something I'd never add to my aquariums. I'd rather empty the tank
out, scrub it down and
start from scratch with a new substrate."

You have used it? I have and it works too. But some plants don't like low levels. Same could be said about algae fix. I've touted copper for a few years, Neil Frank has more even longer.

You can also vacuum the substrate... 1/4 or so at a time each week and remove any excess organic matter, replant the section etc. You can clean every surface and part in a planted tank. Substrate included if you use a porous clay like material. That's about as drastic as I ever get. 

Send me some tasty impossible kill algae anytime. I love new challenges. That is an open invitation to all. 

I am curious as to the species of algae as it does not sound like others I have seen in planted aquairums. 

I will try the product, but I will never buy algicidal products ever again. Anyone wants to send me some etc. I wasted too much time in the past and $ on something that ultimately never lead me to grow plants even one lick better.  But I will test something. 

I like messing with algae and looking at plant requirments/cycling.    

Regards, 

Tom Barr



 





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