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Breeder's Club issues


Had a chat with RR on Sunday evening about Breeder's Club issues.  I 
didn't know that Robert had appointed you Breeder's Club Coordinator 
before I sent my posting, which was simply to get things started - I 
have a LOT to do in my other NFC capacities.  Please accept my apologies 
for the confusion.  I think you will make a great BPC and I am willing 
to help you in any way I can, especially on legal issues.  

I understand that you are aware that this job is going to involve a LOT 
of work.  We have a whole bunch of state officials to convince that we 
are a legitimate organization and are doing things by the book. This 
requires research and discussions and developing a favorable track 
record.  It might require that we get a whole stack of special permits.  
Lots of writing, record keeping and online meetings (along with helping 
the other breeders with their programs and keeping a running inventory 
of who has what available, who needs more equipment, cash flow, 
shipping, etc.).

BTW, I called the Arkansas Game and Fish Commission and got a copy of 
their regulations.  It seems that no baitfish, which includes minnows, 
shiners, etc., can be legally exported from the state of Arkansas. As I 
speak another language (state bureaucratese), this may mean a number of 
things implied by the language that is used in the regulation:

1. You CAN'T sell and/or export wild baitfish captured under a general 
fishing license; OR

2. You MAY be able to export wild baitfish if there is no money 
involved, just trading fish or donations; OR

3. You MAY be able to export wild baitfish if you obtain the necessary 
license(s) or permit(s); OR

4. You MAY be able to export domestically produced offspring of 
wild-caught baitfish but not their parents.

Best idea I can offer is to write up a description of what it is you 
want to do, including alternatives (i.e., if I can't get a license to 
export wild caught shiners, can I breed them and legally export the 
offspring?) and ask for a ruling or determination on the issues 
involved.  That way, you will get an official statement of what avenues 
may be available and what permits may be needed.  Sure beats guessing, 
especially as there may be some provisions in Arkansas law that allow 
certain activities to be exempt from some or all of the regulations.

Suggest that you might want to ask for a Scientific Collection Permit in 
your official capacity as NFC Breeder's Program Coordinator to attempt 
captive breeding of the bluenose shiner. You could state that you wish 
to evaluate methods of domestic propagation, which, if successful, will 
allow you to upgrade your project to a larger fish propagation facility.  
Part of the description would be the distribution of a portion of your 
captive breeding stock to other NFC breeders who would also attempt to 
breed these fish (like me, for instance).  Distribution ensure that 
stock with the same genetics will continue to be available in the event 
of a catastrophe at your house, such as power failure, house fire, tank 
crash, etc.  This is exactly what I did in the Scientific Collection 
permit application that I recently submitted to the Vermont officials (I 
expect approval for my proposed activities). Arkansas should have a 
similar program. 

I can send you a copy of what I put together for the VT officials if you 
want one to use for a working example. Just send me your snail mail 

>From owner-nanf at actwin_com Fri May 22 21:18:19 1998
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>Message-ID: <35664DBD.1FB4F5F at geocities_com>
>Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 23:17:01 -0500
>From: Herb Harris <top_side at geocities_com>
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>To: nanf at actwin_com
>Subject: Re: SERIOUS BREEDERS !!!!!!!!!
>References: <01BD85A9.25E9F9E0@wraith> 
<19980522.191604.9342.0.robertrice at juno_com>
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>Hi Robert, all,
>	Looking forward to being of service to NFC! For now I have a tentative
>list of people that have expressed interest here on the list in the 
>few days, and I look forward to hearing from all of you. Please let me
>know the pertinent info about the species you plan to register in the
>program. I'm setting up a database for this, and if anyone has any
>suggestions, please fell free to contact me directly.
>robert a rice wrote:
>> Hello Herb and all,
>> Herb feel free to appoint volunteers as you see fit to run the 
>> club. I'll talk with you via phone during the next week to touch 
>> The Breeders club must do the following.
>> 1. adhere to all fed and state laws.
>> 2. produce income for the NFC by selling offspring to interested 
>> 3. Add correct information to the NFC database
>> 4. Be a pleasant and fun place for the conservation minded aquarist 
>> further their hobby.
>> Just for the record My managment style is a hands off one. I will be 
>> to assist in any way when ask but for the most part I think you or 
>> other volunteer should be given latitude to do their chosen task in a
>> manner they enjoy. The breeders club like most of the local 
>> and special committees should be stand alone and have a single
>> represenitive report to the BOT and the President when asked. I'll 
>> to you later about the specifics of shipping money and what not. So 
>> you have questions or concerns please ask.
>> Also dont be afraid to recruit members from the deep south to remove 
>> native species and donate them to the club for resale up
>> north............

Dwight D. Moody
P.O. Box 214
East Montpelier VT  05651-0214
802-476-0685 (home), 802-241-3482 (work)
One of the earliest Christian symbols was the fish
(Greek: icthys, which was an abbreviation for the Greek
words in the phrase: Jesus Christ, Son of God, Savior).
Thus, disciples could identify each other by their use
of the fish symbol, which continues to be used today.
Jonah was swallowed by a huge fish and remained
within it for three days and three nights. Afterwards,
he was "vomited" (literal translation) onto the beach
to go and minister to the people of Ninevah (Jonah 2:1-11).
While we often find references in aquarium books
concerning the first instances of fishkeeping
by humans, this appears to be the first instance
of humankeeping by a fish!

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