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Re: [Killietalk] Commercial imports; what to label them?
Hi Ken,
There are tangible benefits to keeping collection data with the fish.
Agnese and colleagues examined some genetic markers among species within the
subgenus Chromaphyosemion (Molecular Phylogenetics and Evolution 40 (2006)
332-346.) They looked at 88 samples, many of which were collected by others
or were established in the hobby. By knowing the locations where these fish
were collected, they were able to focus their own collecting efforts on
places not already sampled. One can then compare the cladogram of species
to maps showing where the species and make inferrences about the evolution
of these fish. These inferences can then generate hypotheses which can be
tested. Without the locations of fish from within the hobby, their data set
would be smaller and some details might have been missed. For example, they
only collected one location of A. poliaki. Four more came from within the
hobby. When plotted on a map, their data suggests to me that A. poliaki is
a valid species.
As to your question about why keep killies at all, everyone has their own
reasons. Obviously we cannot warehouse every population or species
indefinitely. Consider each species is like a painting from one of the
Great Masters. Their paintings have all been photographed and you can buy
books with the photos, so why do we have art museums? To stand in front of
a painting and see the brush strokes with your own eyes is a whole different
experience. You can imagine that a hand not unlike your own actually held a
brush and put paint on canvas. We can see pictures of killies in the books
but to see the fish alive and swimming is also a whole different experience.
It doesn't matter if you believe in Evolution or Creation. You can marvel
at how this little fish came into existence and ended up so far away from
where it started. Do you preserve the original paintings for future
generations to experience? Then you should try to preserve the fish for the
same reason.
Best wishes,
Rich Pierce
ps. I believe that the theory is that the sun will go red giant and consume
the Earth before shrinking down into a white dwarf. Hopefully by then our
vastly superior floating brain intellects will have figured a way off this
rock. Who knows, maybe we will bring some killies along for the ride ;-)
Rich
-----Original Message-----
From: killietalk-bounces+rwpierce=att_net at aka.org
[mailto:killietalk-bounces+rwpierce=att_net at aka.org]On Behalf Of Kenneth
Combs
Sent: Tuesday, July 31, 2007 11:05 PM
To: killifish discussion list
Subject: Re: [Killietalk] Commercial imports; what to label them?
Thing about labeling and such is it is a supportive tool for hobby wide
goals...
the tiresome part may be that nobody or no "body" has ever exactly defined
what those goals and objectives are...
then there is the thing about bringing in more species...this point was
touched upon earlier, but IMO needs addressing...
Barry and others point about conservation is valid, but at what end?...I can
see the whole damn thing getting silly/unweidly:
australe GHF-location 2, creek mile 5
australe GHF-location 3 creek mile 6
SJO "Niger Delta" GPS location longitude 20-latitude 50 mark .0007
SJO "LOE" GPS .....
probably got the point....
...and what is our purpose here; to beat the rain forest bulldozers and
"warehouse" every killiefish on the "world grid" for next million years?
...all the while inbreeding/preserving the genetics from 6 pairs till the
sun goes "white dwarf" and all 200 trillion individuals of homo sapiens has
evolved into disconnected "floating brains"...
I'm not pro/con, for/against conservation or "hybridizing" or really
anything..just demonstrating all these "particulars" are really without any
concerted effort or tangible (pre-defined) goals
KC
----- Original Message ----
From: "BrandtEdL at aol_com" <BrandtEdL at aol_com>
To: killietalk at aka_org
Sent: Tuesday, July 31, 2007 4:28:34 PM
Subject: Re: [Killietalk] Commercial imports; what to label them?
Hi all,
I have to agree with Bob. This thread is getting tiresome and let's
move
on to something else that won't take up 3 days of discussion. Sorry, but
I'd like to hear more about other things in the hobby.
Sincerely, Ed Brandt
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