Re: [Killietalk] Rich Man's club

["Ken" <ken_combs at sbcglobal.net>]

Erny,
I dunno, like most of us, I imagine the BOT have a real-life biz to attend
to, besides I only play "instigator" on the web <LOL>...
And yes, to be honest, for my $25 bucks (which I owe BTW), for me the club
is fine "as-is", I'm sorta hollering for those that don't belong yet....and
BTW, change does not always imply a problem, sometimes as the world changes
around us, so must we...
And as has been said to the point and succinctly, "cry or do"...I am doing
as we speak...

KC (I'm almost one of those semi-old farts BTW, I just digress by 20ish yrs
on the web) 

-----Original Message-----
From: Erny May [mailto:emay1 at wi_rr.com] 
Sent: Friday, January 27, 2006 8:50 AM
To: ken_combs at sbcglobal.net; killifish discussion list
Subject: Re: [Killietalk] Rich Man's club

Ken,

As is usually the case, your summations are very accurate and to the point.
There is one thing you did not answer; what do think is the reason the BOT
members refuse to interact in this informal dialog?

Erny
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ken" <ken_combs at sbcglobal.net>
To: "'killifish discussion list'" <killietalk at aka_org>
Sent: Friday, January 27, 2006 6:50 AM
Subject: Re: [Killietalk] Rich Man's club


I could understand some of the "counters" against "political" talk if
"Greenpeace" tried to join the "Republican Party" (as opposed to the reality
of killikeepers conversating on a broader scope to other killiekeepers)
<LOL>...But if you are out of bullets, it's easier to attack the "gun" as
opposed to deflecting the "projectile", so we get:

-"take this conversation somewhere else"....the expected response when a
suggestion of change is presumed to be from a minority or when the scope of
the subject is outside of their  "entertainment value"
-"They are silent and therefore satisfied"....the presumption that
passiveness = satisfaction and/or your point of view is shared by default
with the majority
-"the org cannot be everything for everybody"....the logic which presumes
the scope or objective isn't overly narrow and now "self-serving";
basically, erroneous internal data w/o the value-add of external
sampling...the presumption that the "deliverable" is satisfying all
potential customers within scope
-"It will drive people off the list"...the presumption that the silent or
non-participants are disinterested in the content

The only other conclusion is I can come up with is: the above presumptions
are based on private off list communiqués and IMO, "tact & class" <in their
minds> is being substituted  for what is really: lack of "onions" to post
(we all must remain popular & conforming, even at the expense of honesty,
lest we be denied our killies)... ;-)

Erny, I hope that answers all your questions...

Ken

-----Original Message-----
From: killietalk-bounces+ken_combs=sbcglobal.net at aka.org
[mailto:killietalk-bounces+ken_combs=sbcglobal.net at aka.org] On Behalf Of
Erny May
Sent: Friday, January 27, 2006 2:00 AM
To: killifish discussion list
Subject: Re: [Killietalk] Rich Man's club

975 members???????? in you dreams.  The only thing that has been asked of
the BOT and the chairman is communication. The reason for lack of use of the
AKA site forums is simply that they are static! They are simply not
conducive to discussion. Asking to be included in the process of running the
AKA via open dialog is hardly taking shots and running. The BOT is an
elected group and in that sense are obligated to keep the membership
informed. Now I don't know about the other "975" members, but I do not
understand why it is that we cannot simply have dialog with the BOT.
Why can't we be informed of what is going on, what is being considered, what
plans and goals are in the offing, when can we expect what.
Along that line of what is needed; I still have not seen a detailed
financial report for this past year. I belong to a number of organizations
and that is simply unheard of.
I can agree with you that killietalk may not be the ideal place but it is a
place that is frequented by members and seems to be the only way to get some
response. Not form the BOT or the Chairman but from members who have an
active interest in the well being of our organization.
I have not noted any personal insults and would certainly like them pointed
out to me; flippancy tinged with sarcasm... I am guilty of that at some
time, but if you look at your response you certainly get to join me.


----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Jacobs" <mjacobs2 at tampabay_rr.com>
To: <killietalk at aka_org>
Sent: Thursday, January 26, 2006 7:35 PM
Subject: [Killietalk] Rich Man's club


> . . . in our haste we are forgetting the above . . . some want to air what
> they feel are problems are being so flippant as to cause damage to the
> fiber
> of most clubs and associations and one of the main reason that most clubs
> stay together . . . the people.  Throwing personal insults at people will
> never fix any club problem that might exist in the club . . . it will only
> tear that club apart to a further degree.
>
>
>
> Well said Tom!!!

>  Now, I have a very simple question . . . of the say 1000 people in the
> AKA .
> . . how many appear to have a problem with the way the AKA is being run?
> I
> read this Killitalk too . . . maybe 10-12-20-25 guys seem to have a real
> problem and want "things" changed?????  That leads to the obvious
> conclusion
> that there are 975 that see no real reason for any major change.  I am
> among
> those 975.  Don't get your shorts in a bunch . . . I know there are a few
> things that maybe need tweaked but most of those things are because the
> people are voluntary to the AKA club and so be it . . . when it's my turn
> to
> "do" I will try some different things and if people can see a very real
> difference then maybe my actions will be repeated in the future. Those of
> you who feel "some things are wrong" . . . in order to convince me and the
> other 975 paying customers you are going to have to delineate what your
> problem is AND give some solutions to this voluntary group.  You can't
> just
> continually take "shots" and run and wonder why 975 people don't agree
> with
> you and why the 975 people don't "impeach Clinton".  I for one am not
> going
> to change a thing in any phase of my life at 60 years old without some
> concrete plan to replace what might be wrong . . . if I agree with what is
> wrong in the first place.
>
>
>
> . . . but I will say this . . . I don't think Killitalk is the place
> either!  I am not afraid to talk and discuss anything with anyone who will
> listen as well as talk but there are more appropriate places than here.
> It
> has been offered by Barry about 100000000000 times.  The AKA site is THE
> place for these discussions . .. Killitalk is just more convenient and
> most
> dissenters simply want a public forum rather than a real forum where
> members
> only can hear.  Take it to the AKA site where as members we can join in IF
> WE WISH . . . if the 975 wish . . . if the 975 wish not to then why should
> the AKA change as you 10-15-20-25 want it to?????  If the 25 can't swap
> the
> 975 then what EXACTLY do you expect us to do?  I want no argument(s) . . .

> I
> really don't but this is like politics and there is no real correct answer
> except you have to keep voting and re-voting.  Maybe Bush will be out next
> time . . . what the heck . . . maybe another Clinton will be "in" . . .
> ;-)
> ;-) ;-)
>
>
>
> See you guys in May!
>
>
>
> Mike
>
>
>
> AKA 2006 Tampa, Fl. See you in the sunshine!
>
> <http://mtfb.com> http://mtfb.com . . . On-Line Aquarium Magazine
> <http://southernapistos.com> http://southernapistos.com . . . Apistos &
> More On-Line
>
> http://sks.aka.org <http://sks.aka.org/>  . . . Killifish Club St.
> Pete/Tampa, Fl
> http://tbas1.com . . . Tampa Bay Aquarium Society
>
>
>
> Join the AKA at http://aka.org/modules/tinycontent0/index.php?id=9
> Archives are at http://fins.actwin.com/killietalk/
> Modify your subscription at
> http://www.actwin.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/killietalk
>
>
> >
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>>
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>
>
>
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>
>
>
>
>


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Join the AKA at http://aka.org/modules/tinycontent0/index.php?id=9
Archives are at http://fins.actwin.com/killietalk/
Modify your subscription at http://www.actwin.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/killietalk