[Killietalk] re: Tank parasites AND NITRATE POISONING

["lee Van Hyfte" <littleleeper23 at hotmail_com>]

Hi y'all,

  That is it BARRY!  Alum you can pick up from tones in the spice racks at 
the grocery stores.  And it will really put pucker in your pucker. Ingesting 
Aluminum is not a great idea.  Metal poisoning is just not my bag.

Wright I would have to seriously disagree with the idea that Nitrates are 
"non-toxic"  less toxic YES!!!  Unless you are a fish that is completely 
never exposed to nitrates in the wild especially discus and many other real 
acid loving fish ie killies!!  Strongly Acid waters never see a nitrate 
cycle.  just ammonium (also a less toxic compound)

Nitrates sneak up on you especially in a well established tank ie: one set 
up for months or years.  The big Ammonia/Nitrite "bloom" converts all into 
nitrate.  Just trying to keep this simple for general hobbyists.  A well 
cycled tank buids up nitrate, though tolerable in most circumstances not 
always so.

Blue baby syndrome, NITRATE poisoning in the hospitals  this is from 
nitrates binding to the oxygen carrying  Red Blood cells.   Reversal with 
Methylene Blue similar to treatment for cyanide poisoning. Hyperbaric oxygen 
will do the trick as well in humans a little difficult for the hobbyist 
HAHA.

Oh by the way do not give your children tap water that has not been tested 
properly for nitrates!!  A family nearby lost 2 children under 18 months 
from a "bad" well!!  USe R.O for your kids till age 4 or so if there is any 
question of quality.  Not to mention there are about a thousand other toxins 
leaching in from the fields.

OK back to fish.   Baby fish are very sensative to Nitrates, some more so 
than others.  If you are a "bad" water changer nitrates can reach very high 
levels ina short period of time.  one month or so especially if you think 
the plants will just use it all up.  Crypts cannot use nitrate as a nitrogen 
source it actually is absorbed into the tissue,  then bulids in the veins of 
the plant and obstructs the vessels when the nitrate binds to metal ions 
becoming insoluable nitrate salts in the tissues.  Cryptocoryne rot!!

If light levels and CO2 levels are not appropriate for plant growth then the 
nitrates will build.  The results are nitrate toxicity.   Decaying plants 
will also convert eventually into a nitrate

The thing is heavy feeding with higher protein foods and a strong biological 
filter.  Will produce more nitrate than the plants can even use.  Poor water 
change habits. and bang a "non-toxic" substance builds high enough to kill 
the fish SLOWLY.  A wasting syndrome is common in Nitrate poisoning as the 
fish is just ill!  Poor apetite.  The fact that removing the fish from the 
original tank helped save the fish may be indicative of toxins!!

Now fortunately if a quality water source is used (nitrate free) a 50% water 
change will reduce the nitrate levels in half. SO CHANGE THE WATER!!!!  This 
does not mean the fish are home free it just means there is a way out with 
consistent water changes.

All this in mind this may not be the answer to the original post just an 
easily reversible potential cause!!! And it beats the hell out of trying to 
almost kill your fish with antiparasitic drugs.  ie: kills the bugs just 
short of killing your fish in the process.

Can anyone remind me do killies produce uric acid or ammonia as a metabolic 
waste prooduct.   Is this species specific. I recall a statement that Fp. 
produce ammonia whereas others produce uric acid. It is a relatively mute 
point more a morbid curiosity.  Same ends different means.

Ok I have rambled enough, God Bless, Lee The Rivnut<><



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