Gheez,
Interesting points, interesting data, interesting topic...however, still
raises more questions than answers.
1st. Looking for that "perfect food" has always been kind of problematic
in my years keeping any large number of fish. On the "fishes side", not
only the actual nutrition, but "feeding stimuli" AND maintain a
reasonable water quality has had to be addressed, esp. w/fry. On the
human side: Cost, convenience (ease of feeding and/or raising) &
availability (quantity or purchasing).
Trying to address all of those and feed your fish while managing time,
money and sanity has a time been difficult. Pardon once again the long
post....
Robert Goldstein wrote:
Bowel obstructions are assumed sometimes when fish get fat from dropsy
and don't eat, but dropsy is dropsy and >has nothing to do with diet.
Yeah, I follow that, but I'm still wondering/thinking if poor diet
causes dropsy to "take hold" (bacterial origin or otherwise). Thing is,
the only variable that has changed recently with my fish is their diet.
Needless to say, the two fish with any "issues" got dropsy. Perhaps,
this affliction opportunistic, and poor diet "triggers" it?
The even higher rate for insects in general aligns with the nutritional
data that show insects as the most
nutritious of all foods, followed by certain crustaceans like several
categories of shrimp..........
And...
Fish cannot eat insects without getting some plant material either
adhering to the insects or contained within >their guts, so there is
your roughage, assuming "roughage" is even necessary.
Yeah, and Humans can't eat commercially grown plants w/o getting
"insects" in their diets (smile)...(last factoid I read claimed we eat
some unmentionable pounds of "bugs" every year...(yeech)
Bottom line - insects are the best fish food.
Sure perhaps for them (the fish)<smile>...my last stab at fruit flies
yielded a very pissed off spouse (smile). Which brings me to the "best
food". I've obtained Killies from a few sources/folks, and while I'm
sure "genetics" has some role in their appearance, I'm 100% sure the
diet affected them even more: If "size matters", no doubt the fish I got
from "The Killifish source" were the largest (if guessing at the age
they were sold). Even my "newbie" eyes could see these fish grew pretty
fast. On the other end; if "size don't matter", Shenne's fish looked
gorgeous: the finnage & colors, et (I "think" those were fed mostly
BBS). My point is apparently there is some considerations for the
breeder with "size/marketability" as a priority, and
"quality/appearance" being another. Obviously cost & convieniance is a
major factor with larger scale ops. Still balancing all of those things
(esp. the $)is challenging
more - studies have shown that beef heart is one of the most nutritious
of all foods (that surprised me).
Me too, because I've read about using beef heart so many times, I kept
trying it exclusively, over and over. To my dismay, I never duplicated
what others have claimed. Sure, the size was there, but the coloring &
shape (at least with the cichlids) was not. TM, negotiating water
quality with a reasonable change schedule was impossible (for me)
Tyrone Genade wrote on 5 Nov 2004 17:49:32 +0100
Too much white worm = bad. This is a good guess and
applies equally well to blood worm etc...
Then on 5 Nov 2004 18:51:35 +0100 said:
First, we fed our adult Nothos 100% bloodworm. Nothing else. We forget
that bloodworm are larvae and are storing up nutrients to make the
transition to... well blood sucking midges. Out Notho grow big and
fast! We start feeding the Notho fry chopped bloodworm from about 2
weeks. By week 4 they are triple the size they were. Fed only on bbs
for 4 weeks they are visibly smaller.
No, I'm not trying to show a "contradictory statement" or anything, just
wondering if you are making a "exception" for short-lived species like
nothos. In other words, given their lifespan and fast growth, just
wondering if "growth speed" is a dietary priority above all else, for
that matter, how big a deal is any "long term health effect" with regard
to Killies? (again just wondering)...
Actually, enriching bbs seems quite easy. Hatch'em, start enriching by
sprinkling in some protein HUFA mix into the hatch container... Let
bubble for at least 48 hrs in total and feed.
That intrigues me, esp. for someone like myself who has raised plenty of
batches of fry. Can't tell you how many "wives tales" we must accept as
fact for lack of being able to research it ourselves. Seems the above
runs contrary to the "feed BBS immediately" wives tale (or is it?)....In
other words, if I can actually "enrich" my hatches, that's important to
me and I would like to be more confident about the validity of that
statement (it sure would keep me from rotating so many bottles, and
change how I feel about "bothering" with BBS hatches)...Not
"challenging", I just would really hate to keep from worrying about
using my hatch so quickly...
Many mental illness
(depression, schizophrenia, etc...) are being traced back to folate
shortages in some patients. Supply folate and the mental problems
vannish.
Perhaps we need to package up this "folate" and sell it from the backs
of our cars (SMILE!), NTM I would really love to spike a few folks
drinks with that stuff (incl. all political candidates, the media..heck
the whole USA country)...(sorry for the "political plug", but gheez
wasn't that whole deal "tiring"?, all the more reason to spread Killies
around, folks need some type of escape...)
Lack of vitamins like folate and HUFAs are (in my opinion) the root
cause of panic attacks in fish where they dart about wildly and damage
themsleves. I'm told by Mach that he got around the problem by feeding
cyclops fed on green water. Cyclops are rich in HUFA and green water
in B-vitamins (eg.g B9 = folate).
I got 2 tanks of Deltaense trios, same age, same size, et.: both tanks
are absolutely identical except Tank #1 is brightly lit, and in the rack
below is tank #2 (very dim). Granted, it could be a "water quality"
issue stemming from "underpowered" java fern, but the behavior of the
fish is radically different. The trio in the "bright" tank, swim out in
the open, beg, ect. The "dim tank" crew hides all day, then "dart out"
for food. Any sudden stimuli sends em crashing into the walls. Chalk it
up to "newbie" ignorance, but I've abandoned the oft quoted "dim" setup
for Killies; just could manage my water the way I'm used to. I guess I'm
wondering if "conditioning" has a lot to do with this "skittish"
behavior (or just as much anyway).
Lee wrote:
I agree, Even for fry, regular and substantial water changes seem to
have
more effect on growth than excessive feeding.
Are ya'll using straight tap? Or "aged water" I've been reading up on a
few threads about raising fry (or hatching eggs) claiming peat is
beneficial. I understand peat releases tannins (or whatever else) that
are beneficial, but could it also be about "absorption"? I realize we
got to dilute the hormones, nitrates and other "nasties", but could peat
assist with this? Oh, I've always used oak leaves in lieu of peat, same
difference?
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