Re: [Killietalk] RE: Killietalk Digest, Vol 4, Issue 67

["Gary Smith" <rivulus at cogeco_ca>]

Hi Dave,
             Can this prestone de-icer be bought at any hardware store or
Walmart?

Gary



----- Original Message -----
From: "Koran, David HQ02" <David_Koran at HQ02.USACE.ARMY.MIL>
To: <killietalk at aka_org>
Sent: Wednesday, November 26, 2003 12:36 PM
Subject: [Killietalk] RE: Killietalk Digest, Vol 4, Issue 67


> RE:  Brackish water killies -- the myth of salt.
>
> If you have tried to work with brackish water killies, after initial
success
> most are doomed to failure.  The biggest problem is continually trying to
> maintain the half salt water/half fresh water chemistry.  I have tried
this
> by building a flow through system of about 16 tanks and about 200-250
> gallons of water.  Maintaining the level of water in the reservoir by
adding
> water for evaporation makes this simple but over time, routine problems in
> the system causes the water chemistry to drift and massive water changes
do
> not sit well with the fish.
>
> Your best bet is to convert the fish to hard water.  When doing so, this
> becomes a one way street because trying to take the fish back to brackish
> usually dooms the fish much as if there was a drastic water change.  Many
of
> the Europeans who handle Aphanius species from brackish systems change the
> the husbandry to the hard water environs and the fish are not the worst
for
> it.  All Aphanius are adaptable as are Cyp. dearborni, Jordanella pulchra,
> Fundulus luciae and especially Aphanius fasciatus.  Another fish, Cyp.
> tularosa, comes from "highly saline water" -- Salt Creek and Lost River
with
> "salinities" as much as 3 times that of seawater.  When I got the fish
> several years ago, I did what most did and used "Instant Ocean" to
> "simulate" water conditions.  When I visited the area a few years later
and
> observed the dunes at White Sands Nat'l Monument I discovered that the
white
> sand was calcium sulfate, the evaporite salt from the waters that are the
> Cyp. tularosa habitat.  Since that time I have made up water that has the
> divalent cations calcium and magnesium (Ca 2+ and Mg 2+) rather than
> monovalent sodium (Na +) with many fold times the success in maintaining
the
> "brackish" water species.
>
> As I said earlier always go the direction away from brackish conditions.
> Make up water with calcium chloride salts.  If you are fussy, use Kent
> Marine calcium chloride (the chemical is formulated into small white
> pellets, this is because the commercial chemical is used in drying oragnic
> liquids [absorbing water] and the pellets don't cake a filter); however,
> only a slightly less pure form is available as Prestone De-Icer which is
> 95-98% calcium chloride -- it is a lot cheaper and guess what, the
> impurities are magnesium, sodium and potassium chloride -- chemical you
want
> anyway.  Getting relatively pure magnesium chloride is a bit tougher.  You
> might be able to locate MAG, which is sold as a commercial deicer from the
> Dead Sea Works (Distributed by Standard Tar Products, Milwaukee, WI), or
> FreezGard from Pottstown, PA.  It is tougher to find in small quanitities
> but a search of web will help, stay away from health food chemicals, they
> will cost you more than if they are sold as aquarium chemicals.  If you
are
> trying to track it down and you have an outlet for deicing products tell
> them you are looking for a magnesium chloride product because you want
> something that doesn't harm concrete and is environmentally safe.
>
> Once you solve your salt source problems and then find the correct
> formulation (information I can help you figure out, I weight my salt out
> using a pan balance which most of you probably don't have, at least
> something capable of weighing salt to the nearest tenth of a gram), and if
> your fish are not spawning, change water gradually, dilution by no more
than
> 50% each hour.  When I do this with fry, I usually wait until they are a
> couple of weeks old and then dilute by a factor of 1/2 to 1/4 (lengthening
> the period by up to 4 times that of adult fish).  Often, if you do these
> changes you may notice that gill plates on the fish don't seem right --
this
> effect you will also see with bad water conditions -- it means you changed
> water too quickly when the fish were developing.  It's usually not a
genetic
> problem, just a water quality issue.  Once fish have spend a good portion
of
> their lifetime in these conditions, they know no other and you should not
> see any impact on reproduction or in succeeding generations.
>
> Once you do this you will also notice that tending to water quality is not
> much of an issue as it is for soft water, salt water or brackish water
fish.
>
> Dave Koran
>
> To join the AKA see http://www.aka.org/pages/join.html



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