[Date Prev][Date Next][Thread Prev][Thread Next][Date Index][Thread Index]
Re: [APD] Aquatic-Plants Digest, Vol 29, Issue 52
I totally agree, someone out there knows, short cuts, proper fertilizing, lighting etc. I would just like to add
one thing , if you are not familiar with your plants, buy a book on aquarium plants. I have seen many
reputable pet stores, fish stores etc. that sell house plant cuttings and even Mundo grass as aquatic. I am
simply saying, make sure your plants are 100% aquatic plants.
I would suggest ordering from a reliable source, then you have time to research. One of the most
reliable and easy to ship plants are, Aponogenton bulbs easy, and relatively cheap. They will usually
live for 9 months then they need a rest period of two months and then off they go again.
Need a source ? aquatic-plants-bounces+jhouse=kattrans_com at actwin.com on behalf of aquatic-plants-request at actwin_com
Sent: Sun 1/29/2006 7:17 PM
To: aquatic-plants at actwin_com
Subject: Aquatic-Plants Digest, Vol 29, Issue 52
Send Aquatic-Plants mailing list submissions to
aquatic-plants at actwin_com
To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
http://www.actwin.com/mailman/listinfo/aquatic-plants
or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
aquatic-plants-request at actwin_com
You can reach the person managing the list at
aquatic-plants-owner at actwin_com
When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
than "Re: Contents of Aquatic-Plants digest..."
Today's Topics:
1. Re: water changes and CO2/non CO2 methods (Liz Wilhite)
2. Re: water changes and CO2/non CO2 methods (Jerry Baker)
3. Re: Water changes and CO2/non CO2 methods (S. Hieber)
4. Re: water changes and CO2/non CO2 methods (S. Hieber)
5. Re: water changes and CO2/non CO2 methods (Barry Anderberg)
6. Re: water changes and CO2/non CO2 methods (Jerry Baker)
7. Re: water changes and CO2/non CO2 methods (S. Hieber)
8. Re: water changes and CO2/non CO2 methods (Vaughn Hopkins)
9. Re: water changes and CO2/non CO2 methods (Liz Wilhite)
10. Re: water changes and CO2/non CO2 methods (S. Hieber)
11. Re: water changes and CO2/non CO2 methods (Barry Anderberg)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Sun, 29 Jan 2006 09:22:06 -0800
From: Liz Wilhite <satirica at gmail_com>
Subject: Re: [APD] water changes and CO2/non CO2 methods
To: aquatic plants digest <aquatic-plants at actwin_com>
I didn't mean to do this experiement, but I did. I have non-CO2 tanks I
treated just like my CO2 tank except I dose them with Excel and add less
fertilizer. I was doing 50% water changes every week. Then I got lazy.
Water changes have become infrequent and smaller. With less frequent water
changes came less frequent fertilization because I wouldn't want to run the
risk of ion buildup. I how have algae in 2 of the 3 non CO2 tanks. They
were crystal clear the whole tie I treated them like CO2 tanks. I do not
have BBA in either tank but some kind of bushy green algae that gets about
an inch long. YMMV -- this is just my limited experience.
Liz
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Sun, 29 Jan 2006 10:03:01 -0800
From: Jerry Baker <jerry at bakerweb_biz>
Subject: Re: [APD] water changes and CO2/non CO2 methods
To: aquatic plants digest <aquatic-plants at actwin_com>
On 1/21/2006 Thomas Barr wrote:
> I do not say CO2 was something algae was competing for with plants.
On 1/28/06 Thomas Barr wrote:
> If the system is CO2 limited die to plant growth, the algae have
> a tough time.
I'm confused.
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Sun, 29 Jan 2006 11:12:53 -0800 (PST)
From: "S. Hieber" <shieber at yahoo_com>
Subject: Re: [APD] Water changes and CO2/non CO2 methods
To: aquatic plants digest <aquatic-plants at actwin_com>
Those aren't CO2-in-the-tapwater issues particularly.
With slow growth tanks ( mild lighting levels and no fermetation bottles or compressed gas CO2 sources), one can do okay without adding any ferts if you already have loads of nutrients in a soil underlayment. Even then, as Ms. Walstad explained at the 2004 AGA Convention, additional nuturients can be necessary for hungry plants like swords. Otherwise, relying on fish food alone, can sometimes end up otherwise adequate NO3 levels but inadequate phosphates. These are slow growing tanks we're talking about so one has plenty of time to notice conditions and make adjustments.
I find the more foolproof method is to add ferts and do water changes, adjusting the dosing for the amount of CO2 and light. This helps avoid the organics that build up over time (which appear to be more an issue for the fish than the plants). It also helps newbies develop a routine for caring for the tanks and keeping an eye on things. With just soil underlayment and no changes, I think certain plants tend to dominate in a tank, eventually making a tank a one plant aquascape unless replanting is done -- a good reason to use pots with this kind of approach since replanting can be kind of messy in a soil underlayment setup.
* * * * * * * * * * * It's new; it's fun; it's the New England Aquatic Plant Society NEAPS, is a newly formed organization interested in aquarium flora and fauna. http://www.ne-aquaticplants.com/
----- Original Message ----
From: Bill D <billinet at comcast_net>
To: aquatic-plants at actwin_com
Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2006 11:59:26 AM
Subject: Re: [APD] Water changes and CO2/non CO2 methods
Well planted, lower light aquaria ("natural", "balanced", or Walstad-type)
do better without frequent water changes. These tanks usually get their
relatively meager supply of nutrients from the substrate or the water column
via natural processes, and water changes remove those nutrients.
I do occasionally get algae in such tanks, but it is easily kept in bounds.
High light, high-nutrient tanks are clearly a different matter.
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Sun, 29 Jan 2006 11:24:16 -0800 (PST)
From: "S. Hieber" <shieber at yahoo_com>
Subject: Re: [APD] water changes and CO2/non CO2 methods
To: aquatic plants digest <aquatic-plants at actwin_com>
Welcome to the wonderful world of aquatic gardening., where the right way to grow plants is this, or this , or this, or this. . . . .
One of the great things about the hobby is one can get a tank to work well so many diff ways. And not every way works for every gardener for every tank. For me that't part of the agravation but more often part of the fun. At the conventions, you get a chance to talk with folks that have been growing plants underwater for decades. I am often surprised to hear some of the methods used, but I admire the results.
Have plants, have fun,
sh
* * * * * * * * * * * It's new; it's fun; it's the New England Aquatic Plant Society NEAPS, is a newly formed organization interested in aquarium flora and fauna. http://www.ne-aquaticplants.com/
----- Original Message ----
From: Jerry Baker <jerry at bakerweb_biz>
To: aquatic plants digest <aquatic-plants at actwin_com>
Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2006 1:03:01 PM
Subject: Re: [APD] water changes and CO2/non CO2 methods
I'm confused.
_______________________________________________
------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Sun, 29 Jan 2006 14:29:18 -0600
From: Barry Anderberg <apd at swoobs_org>
Subject: Re: [APD] water changes and CO2/non CO2 methods
To: "S. Hieber" <shieber at yahoo_com>, aquatic plants digest
<aquatic-plants at actwin_com>
Hey Scott, sounds like a good article for your next piece in AFM.
S. Hieber wrote:
> Welcome to the wonderful world of aquatic gardening., where the right way to grow plants is this, or this , or this, or this. . . . .
>
> One of the great things about the hobby is one can get a tank to work well so many diff ways. And not every way works for every gardener for every tank. For me that't part of the agravation but more often part of the fun. At the conventions, you get a chance to talk with folks that have been growing plants underwater for decades. I am often surprised to hear some of the methods used, but I admire the results.
>
> Have plants, have fun,
> sh
>
> * * * * * * * * * * * It's new; it's fun; it's the New England Aquatic Plant Society NEAPS, is a newly formed organization interested in aquarium flora and fauna. http://www.ne-aquaticplants.com/
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----
> From: Jerry Baker <jerry at bakerweb_biz>
> To: aquatic plants digest <aquatic-plants at actwin_com>
> Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2006 1:03:01 PM
> Subject: Re: [APD] water changes and CO2/non CO2 methods
>
>
>
> I'm confused.
> _______________________________________________
> _______________________________________________
> Aquatic-Plants mailing list
> Aquatic-Plants at actwin_com
> http://www.actwin.com/mailman/listinfo/aquatic-plants
>
>
>
------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Sun, 29 Jan 2006 12:41:16 -0800
From: Jerry Baker <jerry at bakerweb_biz>
Subject: Re: [APD] water changes and CO2/non CO2 methods
To: aquatic plants digest <aquatic-plants at actwin_com>
S. Hieber wrote:
> Welcome to the wonderful world of aquatic gardening., where the right way to grow plants is this, or this , or this, or this. . . . .
>
> One of the great things about the hobby is one can get a tank to work well so many diff ways. And not every way works for every gardener for every tank. For me that't part of the agravation but more often part of the fun. At the conventions, you get a chance to talk with folks that have been growing plants underwater for decades. I am often surprised to hear some of the methods used, but I admire the results.
Agreed. The fact that there are so many ways to successfully grow plants
says to me that there is a lot we don't know. There is an objective
truth out there -- a recipe guaranteed to grow plants well and algae not
so well. The problem is we don't yet know enough to say exactly what
that recipe is. I think mostly we just kinda stumble across it
serendipitously on an individual basis and then try to maintain whatever
it is that we are doing, not knowing what the real causal factors are.
We just know that whatever we're doing works and not to change it too much.
--
Jerry Baker
------------------------------
Message: 7
Date: Sun, 29 Jan 2006 13:28:37 -0800 (PST)
From: "S. Hieber" <shieber at yahoo_com>
Subject: Re: [APD] water changes and CO2/non CO2 methods
To: aquatic plants digest <aquatic-plants at actwin_com>
Well, there is no guarantee that just one scientific theory will be the best. That's not necessarily a problem in philosophy of science but we usually assume just one will ultimately be best and prevail above others.
I'm less ready to make a similar assumption about aquatic gardening methods just as I would be about gardening (aquatic or otherwise) in general. While there are right and wrong ways to do things, there very well might be more than one way to skin a cat. So far, the more we learn, that more that seems to hold true.
sh
* * * * * * * * * * * It's new; it's fun; it's the New England Aquatic Plant Society NEAPS, is a newly formed organization interested in aquarium flora and fauna. http://www.ne-aquaticplants.com/
----- Original Message ----
From: Jerry Baker <jerry at bakerweb_biz>
To: aquatic plants digest <aquatic-plants at actwin_com>
Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2006 3:41:16 PM
Subject: Re: [APD] water changes and CO2/non CO2 methods
S. Hieber wrote:
> Welcome to the wonderful world of aquatic gardening., where the right way to grow plants is this, or this , or this, or this. . . . .
>
> One of the great things about the hobby is one can get a tank to work well so many diff ways. And not every way works for every gardener for every tank. For me that't part of the agravation but more often part of the fun. At the conventions, you get a chance to talk with folks that have been growing plants underwater for decades. I am often surprised to hear some of the methods used, but I admire the results.
Agreed. The fact that there are so many ways to successfully grow plants
says to me that there is a lot we don't know. There is an objective
truth out there -- a recipe guaranteed to grow plants well and algae not
so well. The problem is we don't yet know enough to say exactly what
that recipe is. I think mostly we just kinda stumble across it
serendipitously on an individual basis and then try to maintain whatever
it is that we are doing, not knowing what the real causal factors are.
We just know that whatever we're doing works and not to change it too much.
--
Jerry Baker
_______________________________________________
Aquatic-Plants mailing list
Aquatic-Plants at actwin_com
http://www.actwin.com/mailman/listinfo/aquatic-plants
------------------------------
Message: 8
Date: Sun, 29 Jan 2006 13:38:39 -0800
From: Vaughn Hopkins <hoppycalif at yahoo_com>
Subject: Re: [APD] water changes and CO2/non CO2 methods
To: aquatic plants digest <aquatic-plants at actwin_com>
On Sunday, January 29, 2006, at 12:41 PM, Jerry Baker wrote:
> We just know that whatever we're doing works
Oh, that would be a wonderful experience!
------------------------------
Message: 9
Date: Sun, 29 Jan 2006 14:35:47 -0800
From: Liz Wilhite <satirica at gmail_com>
Subject: Re: [APD] water changes and CO2/non CO2 methods
To: aquatic plants digest <aquatic-plants at actwin_com>
On 1/29/06, Jerry Baker <jerry at bakerweb_biz> wrote:
>
> S. Hieber wrote:
>
> Agreed. The fact that there are so many ways to successfully grow plants
> says to me that there is a lot we don't know. There is an objective
> truth out there -- a recipe guaranteed to grow plants well and algae not
> so well. The problem is we don't yet know enough to say exactly what
> that recipe is.
I disagree. I think there are many recipes out there for what works. There
are many balance points.
------------------------------
Message: 10
Date: Sun, 29 Jan 2006 15:07:09 -0800 (PST)
From: "S. Hieber" <shieber at yahoo_com>
Subject: Re: [APD] water changes and CO2/non CO2 methods
To: aquatic plants digest <aquatic-plants at actwin_com>
Just to be clear, I agree with Liz. What she quotes were Jerry's remarks, not mine.
sh
----- Original Message ----
From: Liz Wilhite <satirica at gmail_com>
To: aquatic plants digest <aquatic-plants at actwin_com>
Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2006 5:35:47 PM
Subject: Re: [APD] water changes and CO2/non CO2 methods
On 1/29/06, Jerry Baker <jerry at bakerweb_biz> wrote:
>
> S. Hieber wrote:
>
> Agreed. The fact that there are so many ways to successfully grow plants
> says to me that there is a lot we don't know. There is an objective
> truth out there -- a recipe guaranteed to grow plants well and algae not
> so well. The problem is we don't yet know enough to say exactly what
> that recipe is.
I disagree. I think there are many recipes out there for what works. There
are many balance points.
------------------------------
Message: 11
Date: Sun, 29 Jan 2006 19:17:43 -0600
From: Barry Anderberg <apd at swoobs_org>
Subject: Re: [APD] water changes and CO2/non CO2 methods
To: aquatic plants digest <aquatic-plants at actwin_com>
I am amazed at the fact that we are able to send human beings into outer
space, split the atom, and uncover the secret laws of the universe, and
yet we cannot figure out why algae grows or doesn't grow in a planted
aquarium.
I find that a little hard to swallow, especially given all the people in
the world with degrees in botany and plant biology, etc., etc. People
in the planted tank community may not have unraveled the mysteries of
algae but I'm pretty sure someone somewhere knows exactly what makes
algae grow, or not. I think.
-Barry
Liz Wilhite wrote:
> On 1/29/06, Jerry Baker <jerry at bakerweb_biz> wrote:
>
>> S. Hieber wrote:
>>
>> Agreed. The fact that there are so many ways to successfully grow plants
>> says to me that there is a lot we don't know. There is an objective
>> truth out there -- a recipe guaranteed to grow plants well and algae not
>> so well. The problem is we don't yet know enough to say exactly what
>> that recipe is.
>>
>
>
> I disagree. I think there are many recipes out there for what works. There
> are many balance points.
> _______________________________________________
> Aquatic-Plants mailing list
> Aquatic-Plants at actwin_com
> http://www.actwin.com/mailman/listinfo/aquatic-plants
>
>
>
------------------------------
_______________________________________________
Aquatic-Plants mailing list
Aquatic-Plants at actwin_com
http://www.actwin.com/mailman/listinfo/aquatic-plants
End of Aquatic-Plants Digest, Vol 29, Issue 52
**********************************************
_______________________________________________
Aquatic-Plants mailing list
Aquatic-Plants at actwin_com
http://www.actwin.com/mailman/listinfo/aquatic-plants