[APD] Weeds and caution(what we should really be talking about)

["Thomas Barr" <tcbiii at earthlink_net>]

Perhaps it might be better to talk about plants and do the Novak limited
tank? It's a vile noxious algae, know to infest cyber space. Bleach and
other chemical method have no effect. While persistent, it's non
replicating.   

I work raising aquatic plants and doing research on them, I also work
killing aquatic weeds. We have to be cautious with this. 

We have to do "the process" so we do not get sued and do things that might
harm othe rpeople or the environment. Then we still get sued, but that is
part of the process sometimes as well. Endangered species, native american
tribes, environmental groups, developers. irrigation districts, Fish and
Game depts, Counties, Fire control districts, drinking water supplies,
wetland conservation, argriculture entities, chemical companies, herbicide
makers, etc............many competing interest. 

Even the process does not guarantee that we will not get sued for using
herbicides which are well tested both at the federal level and the our
State's own pesticide regulation. It's very tough to get approval to put it
mildly. Funny thing is I and the other folks killing these weeds are
environmentalist. But rather than ignoring Biopollution and
biopolluters(self replicating pollution), unlike oil spills, this stuff
only gets worse, not better. Using these for a couple years during the peak
efficacy peroids can eradicate the problem if it's caught early. Then it's
no longer a problem till someone or something puts more weeds out there.

I've done a great deal of work on toxicity of aquatic herbicides. I
recently published an article on control method for Pond Weeds(Potamogeton)
in the Noxious Times. Many people are very scared of aquatic herbicides and
want studies done any time something new is used. But even when the studies
are done, they are still not happy and think it is pure poison and the
weeds are God's creatures and we should let them be............

I find it ironic that Lake Tahoe allows boating(which leak oil, gas, other
human waste), and fertilizers all around the water shed on lawns,
businesses, allow more development in the region, but do not let one iota
of herbicide in the rivers flowing into it or they will sue. The Sacramento
Delta is similar in some respects. Even after showing no residual
herbicides after monitoring their usage for several years, some
enviromentalist have charged that we doped the records, and still apply 2-3
x the suggested rates(Which is a federal offense to do anything other than
the label, except if you wish to dilute the herbicide). Some folks you just
cannot reach, but now we know that the chemicals do not persist. It goes
beyond science or logic and into some irrational psycosis. We saw that here
with the lawsuit. So we look at the positive side. Now we can say, no , the
research showed what we already knew all along and now we have the proof to
show this. 

The Indian tribes want externsive studies done since they use the native
weeds for baskets and use their teeth to strip the fibers. We asked if
there was a certain place in the large lake they might harvest or not( so
we would treat when they are not around and have less potential impact),
but it was a matter of where "the spirits" told them to harvest...... we
obviously do not get involved in spiritual matters, we deal with plants.
There is very high mercury in the sediment around this same lake.There is
place on the lake shore that has it oozing out and you can see it. Unlike
Fluridone, this will never decompose and moves right up the food chain.
They eat fish from this same lake. Many groups sweat the small tiny stuff,
without looking at the larger picture. I see this a great deal. The lawsuit
here on the APD was a classic case. The guy sweated the small stuff and
lost big in many ways.     

Many folks think, they can go out there and pull the weeds up or something.
A small hippy enclave in the Redwoods, very nice folks, had a town meeting,
they decided to try this on a small 1/2 acre pond. We let them have it. 
About 4-5 hours into it, they all gave up and quickly saw how little impact
their efforts achieved.
They all came out of the muddy swamp covered head to toe, all tired and
frustrated. At least they were willing to give it a shot. 
 
My point is that these herbicides are fast to break down, have had many
studies on toxicity to organisms, last generally about 2-5 days and then
decompose into CO2 and H2O. Why make some nasty herbicide that last
forever? We don't need nor want that.The public knows very little about
these chemicals as well. So did I till I educated myself about them.While
many know about pesticides and think they are very bad, the worst ones are
not herbicides which work on __plants__.......they are insecticides which
work on __critters__. Pesticides only kill pest, they might be plants,
fungi or critters. It is a general term. Your food supply poses a much
great risk than the water as far as pesticides. Good reason to buy organic,
taste better anyway.   

If you consider things like producing a good habit for mosquitos and West
Nile Virus(health issues), navigation(commerce/rec boating/fishing),
reduced O2 levels that can kill off entire lakes of
fish/fisheries(Environmental/fishing/public nuisance), reduced water
convayence(Ag and irrigation), clogging of flood control structure(Human
health/endangerment), degradation of recreational uses(Boating,
wildlife/ecotourism), preserving the native plant commnities(the cool rare
plants and critters that depend on them), other treatment options and their
impacts, there are few choices left. We do not have 12 million people
available nor unlimited resources to control weeds, but we do have 12
million acres(more really) of weeds to try and control/eradicate. 

While we grow plants on this list, showing people several miles of
submersed native plants and then some weeds infested areas helps people
realize how bad these weeds really are. Many simply are not aware of it,
off in their own world and are ticked since some aquatic weeds are banned
from sale. If you ever went and saw a lake choked with weeds and saw it
before this occured, most are blown away by the problem. 

Well, folks don't like herbicides, I hate using them if I can do anything
to avoid them, we do that. What ever has the least environmental impact is
our policy but still take care of the problem. The best thing is to do is
keep them from getting into the environment, so exclusion is one way, rapid
response is another, awareness and education is another. 

So many of you on this list are aware about their noxious nature, but it's
the newbie or the poor schlep that doesn't know how to grow their plants
and decides to place the weed in a backyard stream, pond, lake so they can
have an on going supply for their goldfish/koi. Wholesalers and importers
are watched closely, not hobbyists. 

If you do see a patch of Salvinia, Hygro polysperma, anything that looks
like a non native serious weed, call your local county Agricultural
commissioner and tell them you found a potential noxious weed in your area.

Many of you know more about the species than the Ag commissioner's do so
your eyes/knowledge are very helpful to them and your local aquatic
environment.
The sooner you spot them and report it, the better off we all are. Invasive
weeds _are_ pollution, but this pollution gets bigger and worse unlike
other forms of pollution which are not self replicating fast growing weeds.
Many don't think about it that way.

As far as things like Tonia,many of the plants we keep, I think we have
little to worry about. 

Here's a little bit on the marine side of this:

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/nm/20041205/sc_nm/croatia_alg
ae_dc&e=3

I'm trying to ban all Cauplera from CA. This is why. How do you treat
several hundred acres of weeds?
Several thousand? How do you treat the ocean? Herbicides don't work.
Biocontrol does not work this far north. We used Bleach tablets and placed
tarps over the infested areas.  It seems to work if you spot it in time and
have a rapid response. Add some Sharks, bad currents, big waves, it becomes
a real issue. Nothing eats it out here either.Only a few folks can tell the
difference between the species in the genus, this makes finding out what it
is and if it's allowed into CA very tough. Give the scale of the fishiers,
Abalone, SeaOtters, Salmon, Ling Cod, Crabs and more inverts than I can
count, prevention is about the only thing we can do. These things are far
more important than a few weeds that reef folks want to keep and there are
altrernative plants/macros to take their place. 

Hopefully by early next year, the genus will be banned in CA. San Deigo
already has a alw that makes the entire genus illegal to possess, import or
sell.
While we might follow good practices, Biopollution is serious and causes
lots of financial damage to fisheries and habitats. The cure is bad,but
does not last long and things recover quickly, ignoring it far worse. 
Unlike an oil spill, this stuff self replicated and gets larger and larger.
So it does not go away over time, it gets worse.  

This is true for some other freshwater weeds as well.
When we ban these weeds, it's a very good thing. Some might feel it's
depriving them of their plants, but the species we ban are noxious weds,
not some rare hard to grow Crypt, or new stem plant. It's the common stuff,
the pond plants etc. Newbies might toss this out into a river, someone
might add some Egeria densa or Najas/Hyrillia/Lagarosiphon to the creek to
have an on going supply of it to feed their goldfish/koi. How many folks
can tell the difference between those 4 plants?
A trained botantist with very good references and a stereoscope can, but
few others can with certainty.   

So as you can see, there are many large finacial issues with aquatic
plants, jobs, things we can do beyond our hobby if we so chose. 
So get out, see the plants in nature, preserve and protect these places.

Regards, 
Tom Barr
 





     
    



 
 


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