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[APD] RE: Charley's Big a** tank
> Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 05:41:42 -0800 (PST)
> From: Charley Bay <charleyb123 at yahoo_com>
> Subject: [APD] Re: A large tank
> To: aquatic-plants at actwin_com
> Not to revive the "acrylic v. glass" debate, but I'm
> really on the fence. We all know acrylic (flexible,
> nice bends, very strong, corners welded, index of
> refraction same as water, if scratched can be buffed
> out), and glass (more scratch resistant, wears better,
> but not as strong as acrylic). Also, for marine
> tanks,
> glass is more durable since there are lots of abrasive
> critters that stick to acrylic.
Several larger tanks have done well with either.
I like Acrylic due to it's light weight and other parts made from this
material than can be added.
I would look at public aquarium displays for design ideas, many of them
have open tops with front panes of acrylic or glass in some cases.
Mostly acrylic.
The edges of these can be flame polished for a nice look.
Glass takes a little more but can be done as well.
> Since I'm in Colorado, USA, I've been looking at
> Reynolds Polymer,
> <http://www.reynoldspolymer.com/>
> who provided the acrylic to the now bankrupt Ocean
> Journey in Denver (OJ got bought by Landry's Seafood,
> and are still operating). You can get similar
> products from other acrylic manufacturers, and a
> 36"x48"x120" acrylic tank I've seen as low as
> $2400-$4000, depending on what 'custom' requirements
> you have.
There's a couple of others but location is prime when shipping is added.
> For glass, I'd probably go with something like the
> 'starphire' line,
> <http://www.ppg.com/gls_commercial/starphire/default.htm>,
> which is *very* clear, can laminate multiple sheets
> if over 1/2", looks great, and is used for zoo
> exhibits. I don't know the cost on that type of glass
> specifically, but other reports puts a glass tank
> of that size at about $4000 (buying from the
> manufacturer is about half the price of buying from
> an aquarium builder). Watch the "hidden" costs like
> packing, shipping crates, and freight-- that can
> double the price.
This will cost you more than the acrylic!
I promise.
I like glass an all, but for larger tanks, acrylic is better.
But using front planel displays like they use in Zoo's can allow you to use
glass at 30" depths and good size panes.
> I agree with Tom that it would be best to use as much
> ambient light as possible, even direct sunlight if
> you can. I do that with my tanks, and it works great.
> But, a tank this size is probably more centrally
> located, so that can be hard.
Skylights then.
You need to maximize the light coming in.
Do not underestimate the sun's intensity, even cloudy days are much
brighter than a full bank of PC's.
But a few large MH's w/electronic ballast will really do super for the
w/light output(around 120-130 lumens /watt at least).
Also, I agree that it's
> probably most economical to not run a heater. I never
> did on my 180g, and it's fine (the water mass is
> large enough that daily flux isn't significant, and
> seasonal flux is slow). But, I'm looking to use
> geothermal ground loops for heating/cooling, maybe
> a heat pump, to let me keep temperate marine life
> (for breeding seahorses and maybe dragons).
You will need a very very deep tank for breeding SeaDragons:)
I think 18 ft or so.
Long PVC pipes in the ground 20ft down are good for air and water cooling
in the summer.
Gas exchange for heat. But these systems this large tank a few days to get
moved much one way or the other.
> Depth... I *used* to think that it was silly for a
> plant keeper to go more than 30"-36", because you need
> to put your arm in the tank regularly for aquascaping.
> I kind of believe that still, but as the big_tank.jpg
> shows, there are lots more options for multi-level
> aquascaping when you go for vertical space. And, some
> plants are big, and some fish really prefer the deeper
> water for breeding. (For marine, I'd need 36" deep
> minimum to breed some seahorse spp.) So, I'm now
> thinking of going a little deeper, 36"-48", and having
> plateaus at 24" down with most of my aquascaping, and
> the deepest parts of the tank will be more bare/rocky
> so I won't need frequent access. You can get long
> tongs and attachments for pruning/planting, although
> most of the "big" ones are 24"-36", so I may have to
> build my own.
I held the pruner by the ankles ansd brought them up every minute or so.
This two person team worked as long as there was no angst between myself
and the other person. I will miss that last guy that worked for me:)
I drained the tank down a foot or two, then hung with my legs out, body
dangling inside.
This works well.
If you want, adding Crypts to the bottom layers works well.
> I have a number of designs I've been doing for floor
> plan, plumbing, electrical, lighting, etc., but I'm
> interested in ideas and other experiences. I suppose
> it may be good to contact public aquariums, but I
> don't know anyone there. If anyone on this list would
> be interested in reviewing my plans or providing
> feedback, I'd be interested.
I know several places, both FW and SW.
Protecting against moisture, venting
> heat from the MH lights back into the room when the
> tank is built-in, etc.
These are easy to deal with and you'll have a similar system in the
Greenhouse I would think.
> Big tank... good. Bigger tank... gooder. Keep in
> mind that a $2K acrylic wall with a $350 load of
> cement will give you a 20,000 gallon tank. That
> doesn't sound too bad, now, does it? ;-)))
I like my meandering stream/river going through the center of the house
idea with panes added in sections as the stream descends.
I can subdivide each "tank" and keep this wild natural look in step with
simple straight clean lines of the house.
Email me if you want Charley.
Regards,
Tom Barr
>
> --charley
>
>
> __________________________________
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> Free Pop-Up Blocker - Get it now
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>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 07:53:53 -0800
> From: <orders at aquatic-store_com>
> Subject: [APD] RE: Xmas Moss
> To: <aquatic-plants at actwin_com>
>
> Art Check with Don from freshwateraquariumplants.com He had some last
time
> I checked and is a pretty good guy to work with
>
> KASSELMAN Aquarium Plants 65.99
>
> DO YOU WANT A free co2 regulator or diffusor?
> Swing on by our webbforum to see how to get one!!
>
> http://aquatic.yupapa.com/phpbb/index.php
>
>
> Marc
> ________________________________
>
> Http://Aquatic-store.com
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 07:13:53 -0800
> From: "Eric Wahlig" <ewahlig at earthlink_net>
> Subject: [APD] RE: Heated water
> To: "aquatic plants digest" <aquatic-plants at actwin_com>
>
> I have soft water also; buffered up by the water municipality to 3 degrees
> GH and only chlorine as a disinfectant so I pretty much follow the same
> method as Rachel. I live in a condo complex and we have replaced 2 of the
3
> or 4 large water heaters within the last year. I might be concerned about
> the leaching of copper from these for certain aquarium setups but they see
> a lot of continuous use and because the plumbing is not insulated, it
takes
> several minutes of running the tap to get the water temperature to
> stabilize. The cold water starts out at room temperature but gets very
warm
> then cools off a little then warms up again before finally going cold. The
> hot water takes a while to finally get up to a stable hot temperature.
> Controlling the temperature is the trickiest part and I have to monitor it
> closely as the tank is being filled as it still tends to slowly drift.
This
> may be because the single lever faucet is old and is starting to wear out.
> So, I think that new copper plumbing might be a concern if the water sat
in
> contact with it for a long time but not a problem if fresh water is moving
> through it or you flush any standing water. This could be a problem with
> single family home water systems where you could easily flush the cold
> water lines simply by running the cold water tap but you wouldn't want to
> flush the hot water lines by draining and refilling the hot water heater.
> If you are concerned about the possibility of copper contamination I'd use
> a little Seachem Prime or similar product. Normally, with freshwater
> planted aquaria, I am not concerned with copper but I might be if I was
> running a reef/invert setup.
>
> ---Eric
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 09:53:44 EST
> From: Billionzz at aol_com
> Subject: [APD] RE: Optimum nutrient levels
> To: aquatic-plants at actwin_com
>
> Hi Chuck,
>
> Thanks for taking the time to answer my questions on dry vs liquid
nutrients.
>
> I will now switch to dry. I already have stump remover but I'll look for
> larger quanity's for extra savings.
>
> Bill
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 10:14:34 -0500
> From: "John Thompson" <jdt70 at earthlink_net>
> Subject: [APD] needle valve needed?
> To: aquatic-plants at actwin_com
>
> I recently set up a pressurized CO2 system on my planted tank. I bought
a cheap needle valve and have found it is pretty much only usefull as an on
off valve. While I am looking for a good needle valve I have come up with
an alternate approach. I have simple adjusted the flow rate from the
output pressure adjustment on the regulator itself (I have a standard 2
guage welding regulator with a screw that adjust the output pressure). I
have been able to set it at 10 bubbles/min and it has been stable for 2
days now. Is this approach ok or am I setting myself up for a dump? If I
do replace my cheap needle valve what should I set the regulator output
pressure to? Common sence would direct me to set it as low as possible. I
have been wrong more than once before though. Your advise and suggestions
are much appreciated. Also, links to places that sell needle valves would
be nice.
>
>
> John Thompson
> jdt70 at earthlink_netFrom jdt70 at earthlink_net Wed Dec 17 10:49:10 2003
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> To: aquatic-plants at actwin_com
> Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 10:49:15 -0500
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> Subject: [APD] need for needle valve?
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>
> I recently set up a pressurized CO2 system on my planted tank. I bought
a cheap needle valve and have found it is pretty much only usefull as an on
off valve. While I am looking for a good needle valve I have come up with
an alternate approach. I have simple adjusted the flow rate from the
output pressure adjustment on the regulator itself (I have a standard 2
guage welding regulator with a screw that adjust the output pressure). I
have been able to set it at 10 bubbles/min and it has been stable for 2
days now. Is this approach ok or am I setting myself up for a dump? If I
do replace my cheap needle valve what should I set the regulator output
pressure to? Common sence would direct me to set it as low as possible. I
have been wrong more than once before though. Your advise and suggestions
are much appreciated. Also, links to places that sell needle valves would
be nice.
>
>
> John Thompson
> jdt70 at earthlink_net
>
> John Thompson
> jdt70 at earthlink_netFrom js5 at seidman_net Wed Dec 17 11:35:34 2003
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> From: "Jim Seidman" <js5 at seidman_net>
> To: <aquatic-plants at actwin_com>
> Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 10:35:33 -0600
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> Subject: [APD] RE: Cyanophyta/BGA
> X-BeenThere: aquatic-plants at actwin_com
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>
> Tom Barr wrote, in the context of treating BGA:
> >>Adding KNO3 to about 10ppm, doing large water changes weekly prevent it
> >>from ocurring.
>
> I hope I'm not being dense here, but do you really mean dosing to 10 ppm
of
> KNO3, or do you mean adding enough KNO3 so that there's 10 ppm of nitrate?
> The latter would require roughly 60% more KNO3 than the former, so I just
> want to make sure I understand what you meant.
>
> Thanks,
> Jim Seidman
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 7
> Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 09:35:51 -0700
> From: R S Ahl <rsahl at dimensional_com>
> Subject: [APD] (no subject)
> To: "Aquatic-Plants at Actwin_ Com (E-mail)" <aquatic-plants at actwin_com>
>
> >Geat advice, Rachel.
>
> >I like to use an electronic digital thermometer because I
> >can get a quick reading right at the mouth of the python
> >and they are harder to break than mercury filled-glass bulb
> >thermometers.
>
> >Possible problems that whack the temperature after you get
> >it just right:
>
> >If your hot water heater runs out of hot water. "Why didn't
> >you tell me you just took one of your marathon showers?"
>
> >As the hot water heats up the faucet, the valve may swell
> >and constrict the flow of hot water or someone fiddles
> >with the knobs "Hey, did one of you guys touch the faucet?
> >I had it set just right."
>
> >Someobdy flushes. "Hey, nobody goes until I'm finished
> >with the fish." "Ruhhh ite, dad, that'll work."
>
> >All of these probs may tend to be worse in the cold season
> >when the cold water is colder and you are flowing more hot
> >water. Also when my daughters are in the house.
>
> >Scott H.
>
> >--- Rachel Sandage <rachelsor at hotmail_com> wrote:
> >> I was told that it's important to run the water in the
> >> morning to flush the
> >> pipes before you use tapwater, because things can leach
> >> in if it's been
> >> sitting a long time. That said, I use a hose from my sink
> >> to the tank for
> >> the 29 and 75 gallon tanks, and have never had any
> >> problems. I use cheapo
> >> dechlor (no chloramine here) and put it straight into the
> >> tank before I
> >> start refilling - somewhere between 1x and 3x the
> >> recommended dose. I should
> >> also point out that there's a pretty major difference in
> >> chemistry between
> >> my tank and tap - tap is GH=KH=1, ph 7.6 out of the
> >> faucet; tank is GH=KH=5,
> >> pH =6.8.
> >>
> >> The only caution I have is that some faucets drift in
> >> temperature - the one
> >> I use to fill the 75 drifts pretty radically, and I did
> >> kill most of my
> >> cardinal tetras once when I didn't notice how cold the
> >> water had gotten. Now
> >> I use a thermometer and my skin-o-meter to keep an eye on
> >> it, and haven't
> >> had any problems.
> >>
> >> -rs
>
> Here is was I used in photography class.
>
> http://www.thephotoctr.com/pictures2.php?idnum=1070
>
> I ended up using George Booth method. Tetra temp stuck to the faucet.
>
> Steve
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 8
> Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 08:48:28 -0800
> From: Dave Gomberg <dave1 at wcf_com>
> Subject: [APD] Re: CO2 Needle Valve
> To: aquatic-plants at actwin_com
>
> At 06:42 AM 12/15/2003, Scott Hieber suggested:
>
> >The cClippard is pretty good. You can find ti for a little
> >as about $15 but more often for abut $18-$20.
>
> The Clippards I have seen are minimalist and not suitable for sonic
> operation (which is the main value of a needle valve).
>
> > The
> >Swagelock BMG-2 handles nicer, imo, but costs about twice
> >as much.
>
> The Swageloks are good, but pretty pricey and not set up for our use
(with
> hose). They are set up for use with compression fittings and Swagelok
> proprietary fittings.
>
> >The Swagelock B-SS2 is even nicer, and allows very
> >fine control but costs a small fortune is only for those
> >that don't care what stuff costs.
>
>
> And there are nicer ones yet, like the Hoke which costs over $100.
>
> Now back at the ranch, I have a very nice brass one (American made) which
> costs $27 postpaid and which will outperform all but the better Swageloks
> and Hokes and is set up for standard airline hose (or its CO2 resistant
> cousins).
>
>
>
> --
> Dave Gomberg, San Francisco NE5EE gomberg1 at wcf dot com
> http://www.wcf.com/co2iron for low cost CO2 systems that work!
> 500th System Sale: 6 Fabco needle valves and 6 Eheim diffusors
> Regularly $300 postpaid, now $200 postpaid Gas those other tanks! No
> manifold needed.
> -----------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
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>
> End of Aquatic-Plants Digest, Vol 4, Issue 62
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