Substrates

["Charles Kuehnl" <ckuehnl at cox_net>]

In response to my question about three substrates,
Tom Barr wrote:
 
>> Their ad even says "No additional Carbon
>> Dioxide system required".
>
>Well I can say that about any substrate. Doesn't mean it'll grow plants
as
>well as adding CO2 gas. So what does that really mean? Not much.
>I can add peat and claim the same thing.
 
I sort of thought that but wondered if they had something in the
substrate that might release CO2 into the aquarium.
 
>> FloraBase is pH stabilized and will assist in
>> maintaining the correct pH beneficial for aquatic plants.
>
>Again, what's this mean? CO2 not pH is the issue.
>
>> It will maintain a stable pH between 6.5
>> and 7.0 and it is not recommended for use with fish that need a
pH>>7.0.
>
>I hate it when folks say a certain pH is good for plants. Why?
>
>This is a bunch of crap. I routinely can take folks and see plants at a
pH
>of 5 and a pH of 7.8 and the plants are growing great. What does this
mean
>when they say this?
 
Yes, with GH and KH >12 and a substrate made primarily of gravel with a
couple of laterite balls and the junk that has accumulated over a couple
of years (I guess you call this mulm) I have grown plants too (thanks to
you guys on the list).  I first became aware of this list and planted
tanks just after setting this tank up with a gravel only substrate and
have never had time to tear it down to fix it.
 
I recall one of the early PAMs had an article on aquarium chemistry.  I
think Jamie Johnson wrote it.  It had a section discussing the
ammonium/ammonia balance (NH4 <=> NH3 + H+) being influenced by pH.  At
an acidic pH (<7.0) the equation is driven to the NH4 side which as I
recall the article said plants use.  With a basic pH (>7.0), the
equation is driven the other way to a higher ammonia concentration.  I
thought this was a bad thing (doesn't it kill fish?).  Since pH is the
concentration of H+ and a lower pH (more H+) would ensure all of the NH3
(kills fish) gets used up making NH4 (feeds plants).  I also seem to
recall from a long time ago when I first started with fish (no plants)
that a slightly acidic pH made for healthier fish - something about
fungus having a tougher time in pH < 7.0 and the slime coat being
healthier and more disease resistant with pH < 7.0.
 
>> It takes about an hour for the pH to stabilize after first use.  If
you
>> have GH >> 8.0, the resultant pH may be above 7.0.  What I found most
>> interesting was "For best results replace FloraBase after 12 months".
>
>Now there's a wonderous job.
>
>> Now wouldn't that be fun!  As if tank maintenance and chemistry
wasn't
>> enough.  I guess that is to replenish the carbon contributing
material
>> in the substrate.
>
>A substrate should get better with time, not worse. Just when a tank
gets
>mature and stabilized you have to break it down? I guess some companies
are
>only thinking 12 months ahead.
>
>> Volcanit is a pH neutral aquarium gravel of volcanic origin. The fine
>> pore- structure of the gravel encourages bacterial activity that
>> enhances the biological release of nutrients in the gravel.  Volcanit
is
>> mixed with 5% ferrolit; a zeolite bound long term iron fertilizer.
The
>> resultant black and red color of the Volcanit enhances the beauty of
the
>> aquarium plants and the color of your fish.
>
>This is decent. A bit like profile/Turface etc. Some volcanic rock has
>PO4(good) and is pretty light weight(bad).
 
Am I missing something here?  I do not see anything in their information
indicating volcanit contains volcanic rock other than the similarity of
the name Volcanit and volcanic.  Is volcanit a formal name for a
geological material (like laterite) or is it a trade name only?  I had
assumed it was a trade name.  This is primarily why I posted this.  This
stuff is way out of my area of experience.  I have e-mailed AB Aqualine
asking for info but have not heard anything yet.
 
>> Does anyone have any experience with these last two?  Can those in
the
>> know surmise anything from the descriptions?  Excluding FloraBase
which
>> explicitly says not to mix with anything else, can or should you use
>> these with other substances (gravel, laterite, substrate fertilizers,
>> etc.)?
>
>No, you will not need any laterite, that's for plain sand. You can add
>ground peat and mulm from a mature tank's gravel bed to any new tank.
>Adds what you need.
>
>> I know many of you will say get some Flourite or Onyx.  I have some
>> Flourite and have used it with success.  I would use it on this new
tank
>> but there will be a lot of it and the color just does not look good
in
>> the room the new tank is going in (after all the decorating we have
done
>> I have to keep my wife happy).  My tap water is about 12-13 KH so I
am a
>> little afraid of using something like Onyx that might further
increase
>> my KH. 
>
>Add peat the bottom and it'll maintain the KH, might even lower it
>some:) My tanks has peat + mulm and onyx. My KH has not moved about
about
>4ppm, less than 1/2 a degree.
>Therefore this is not an issue.
 
I am surprised to hear that Onyx only raised your KH 4 ppm.  With all
the info from Seachem about it being great for maintaining a high KH for
African Cichlids I would have figured it to have a much greater affect
on KH.
 
Will peat actually lower the KH.  I have been thinking about a little RO
mixed in with my tap water to get the KH down to the 4-8 range.  Will it
take the water down from 12 to the 6-8 range?  Does the efficacy of peat
change over time (get used up and need replenishment)?
 
>> Although I like the color of FloraBase I am a little reluctant
>> to use it for similar reasons:  not sure what the pH buffer in it is,
>> how that buffer affects CO2 addition (pH table - although they say it
is
>> not required), wondering what pH I would end up with at GH and KH
around
>> 12 to 13, and definitely do not want to replace everything in a year.
>> Thanks
>> Charles
>
>Well if KH etc is the issue, red flourite is an option.
 
Great stuff!  This time it is strictly just the cosmetics (color).
 
>Onyx is nice. I use it in a non CO2 tank and am pleased.
 
I am going pretty high light with this tank and will need the CO2 to
keep up.  Yes I do listen to you :)
 
>
>Regards, 
>Tom Barr 
 
Still nothing about Eco-Complete (http://www.carib-sea.com/Carib1.htm).
Tom, do you or anyone else have any thoughts about it?  I kind of like
their attitude about it - they put the plant nutrition information right
on the package and in their ads.
 
 
Thanks for all your help.
Charles


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